Guardian Vs New York Life Career Contracts

[MDRTM]

Looking for some biased/unbiased - been there before or just looked from the outside in - advise on both companies - compared to each other. I have read topics from Direct Recognition to Renewals. Any and all insight to which is the better one to spend the next 30 years of my life with is appreciated. Seems for the client perspective either one can provide good products and services. Really looking selfishly at this point - which one for my sanity / flexibility / and family

Many Thanks for your responses

Guardian vs New York Life Career Contracts

 

[VolAgent]

Interview both managers hard. Also, make sure to talk to agents there, and not just the ones they want you to talk to. Make sure the office isn't full of old geezers or newbies. You want a nice mix of both, you really want to see a lot of 5-10 year agents. That means that they are graduating people through the 4 year startup process.

Ultimately, the contract isn't that important, what is more important is which manager/office is going to do a better job of teaching you to prospect and sell.

 

[crimsontideagent]

What Vol says is spot on - manager makes it or breaks it, BUT at some point, whether its 4 or 5 or 10 years you are basically going to be running your own show.

And that being said, if you stay your entire career... the Guardian contract is one of, if not the best.

 

[houcoogster]

Ask them what their turn-over rate is and watch 'em squirm.

 

[Larry Tew]

...And that being said, if you stay your entire career... the Guardian contract is one of, if not the best.

I'm not familiar with the NYL contract, but I was a Guardian FR for 9 years. Their contract has many moving parts on the renewal side, and if things (persistency, erratic production from one year to the next, etc) are less than ideal, the contract has multiple ways to take big chunks out of your a$$. And then there's the no vesting thing.

 

[BNTRS]

I often tell people the Guardian FR contact is a lot like an indexed product, looks great on paper, but in practice it's a different story.

*Puts on helmet as rocks begin to fly*

If you search through the forum for topics related to this question (and there is a plentiful amount of them I assure you) you'll find one consistent recommendation that is spot on--and Vol has already suggested this, but I'll highlight it.

The contract, products, and company name are of relatively little use to you. The talent at the office is everything. You need to to put both agencies under the microscope and try to determine the one what can best help you succeed.

This being said, there is--perhaps--a little bit of ancillary consideration that will help tip the scale if things are close, or confuse the hell out of you moving forward in your decision making process.

Guardian is probably the more individual-basis-adviser-focused company. NY Life likes to do a lot of group business. However, experience (by which I mean talking with people who have talked to people) tells me NY Life's focus can vary a bit from agency to agency.

Broker/Dealer wise, I think Guardian has the upper hand here, which is frankly very very sad.

Both companies are missing what is commonly considered a key (read fundamental) insurance product from their proprietary line up--or soon will. NY Life has no prop. DI product (at least not on an individual basis) and starting the beginning of next year (or sooner if they choose) Guardian will no longer have an individual LTCi product.

WL product wise both have solid contracts. Guardian has more contracts, but NY Life has some features that would allow you to replicate most (not entirely all) of what Guardian can offer (e.g. 10 pay, 20 pay, paid up at 65 and 100).

Riders wise, Guardian is the most dynamic in the industry in my experience on a WL contact, their GIO, accelerated death benefit, waiver of premium, and PUA rider is better than everyone else I've come across. But that doesn't mean you'll necessarily be beaten down if you are leading with NY Life. The way Guardian allows WL/term blending also means you can build a contract with guarantees, but a lot of flexibility like a UL--much like NML agents are pushing it these days.

Term rates are usually--but not always--a little lower at Guardian. Neither company is a stellar term company, and you'll likely find someone else (Genworth, Banner, Ohio National, etc.) with which to write your term only cases.

UL...if you are a career agent with either company and writing a lot of UL something is seriously wrong, and both companies will tell you this. Neither company has an extremely awesome UL contract. Though the advantage goes to NY Life here--IMO.

Neither company is leading the industry in the Variable Annuity arena, though Guardian has the advantage. Still, there are much better choices outside of both that you should go to before you consider either of them.

Neither has a great fixed annuity (with one caveat I'll touch on in jut a second) and neither does an indexed product of any kind--they abhor them.

The one caveat the the last paragraph is SPIAs (single premium immediate annuities). Both companies have one (Guardian finally got theirs back about 6 months to a year ago), but NY Life's is much better, in fact they've been well recognized in the industry for their SPIA rates.

Proprietary mutual funds neither company gives a crap about, so it's not worth spending any time talking about.

NY Life has a pretty strong LTCi product (though a bit pricey) and Guardian has what many regard as the best DI product in the industry. If you have some sort of leaning on being product focused this might be of interest.

Now, the more important company culture stuff. Both are kool-aid types. Guardian has decided there is lots of money to be made in selling software to it's agents. It makes several million dollars every year from subscriptions paid for it's proprietary planning software LBS--e-money based program tweaked to highlight the benefits of permanent life insurance. It's not a cheap user fee at $3600/year, and there's been some pressure from the home office to get GA's to get more career agents who subscribe. I think an important question you need to ask the Guardian office is their focus on this. Some will require that you subscribe from day one--this is potentially disastrous.

Again, it's all about the what can you do for me (and by me I mean you). If you can tell us where you are located, I might be able to give you some additional background on agencies.

 

[VolAgent]

Now, the more important company culture stuff. Both are kool-aid types. Guardian has decided there is lots of money to be made in selling software to it's agents. It makes several million dollars every year from subscriptions paid for it's proprietary planning software LBS--e-money based program tweaked to highlight the benefits of permanent life insurance. It's not a cheap user fee at $3600/year, and there's been some pressure from the home office to get GA's to get more career agents who subscribe. I think an important question you need to ask the Guardian office is their focus on this. Some will require that you subscribe from day one--this is potentially disastrous.

Let me just add, software does not sell insurance, people do. There is not a single piece of software necessary to sell insurance, not even illustration software. All you need is a rate book, sure calculating future cash values would be a nightmare, but if you sell death benefit and premium, then a ratebook is all you need.

I'm not suggesting you carry around a ratebook, good luck finding one, but a cheat sheet of term prices can be invaluable. Every time you have to come back for that first piece of business decreases the likelihood you'll get it. I'm not suggesting you be a hard closer, but never pass up an opportunity to ask for the business. Plenty of people are ready to make a decision now and will say yes, but will suffer from paralysis of analysis if given the chance.

Grill the managers, and grill them hard about what prospecting system they are going teach you, and how long they are going to spend teaching it.

Also, you might want to look into other career systems, Mass Mutual, Northwestern Mutual, and MetLife. Also Ohio National runs a career system in some states. Again, the company isn't important. If you represent yourself right, the only people who will care about the name on your card are pikers and home office geeks.

Just remember, your job is to fill out applications for insurance on willing buyers and collect checks for first month's premium. The product and the company name on the check are secondary.

 

[BNTRS]

Just remember, your job is to fill out applications for insurance on willing buyers and collect checks for first month's premium. The product and the company name on the check are secondary.

Getting payments for months 2-12 is helpful, too

 

[xrac]

Here is my opinion if all things office management wise were equal the advantage would go to Guardian in my book due to:

1)Better contract
2)More freedom
3)More flexibility (see #2)
4)Outstanding WL
5)Best white collar DI

However, as others have said go with the one that has the best office management, the best training, and the best chance of having a mentor. Remember that NYL is probably more concentrated to the high end as far as their martket. Consider what your market is.

 

[VolAgent]

Getting payments for months 2-12 is helpful, too

True, but we don't collect them, that is what the PAC is for. Of course, annual checks are best.