When is it working outside of domiciled State

[URDRWHO]

Assume I have a client that lives in my State, has their auto and homeowners with me in my State. I am licensed in my State.

The client says, hey I have a boat dock over in XYZ State that I want liability coverage can you add it as an endorsement. The insurance company says yes --- endorsement is added.

Because the dock is in another State, do you have to be licensed in that State to add the endorsement.

My client is in my State, the policy is issued in my State and I am doing work for them in my State. The risk may be in another State but from what I read in my DOI laws, as long as I am working withing my State, within the boundaries of my State, the policy was issued in my State such an endorsement wouldn't be outside the rules.

Another example -- a snow bird.

Let's say I have the Auto & HO insured on the snow birds house up north. The snow bird drives up north for the summer. The car they drive up north is the car they just bought in Florida, it is still registered in Florida but they are here for three months. They are current clients with a auto/HO policy in their State, the car is garaged for the summer in the northern State. Can they endorse that car without the agent being licensed in Florida? Since all work is being done in the domiciled State of license I say yes.

I know for a fact and it was 30 years ago I asked the DOI about life insurance licensing and selling to an out of State person. That rule was as long as the person is in your State, papers signed in your State it is legal. Same held true for all life, health, annuities. It didn't matter where the person's legal residence was --- what matter was you were doing business within your State of license.

I understand the entire idea about "selling" across State lines without a license but policy servicing is different from selling.

I live at the border of two States. On farms and some residential property the property lines are in two different States. Even though the deed is registered in one State do you need two licenses to insure such properties.

 

[fed up]

On Life, the rules have been lenient and the old adage was to carry some dirt in your pocket so you could write anyone on (home state) soil.
With P&C I don't quite understand your question because you speak of endorsements. Endorsements to what? If the address is in a different state you will need a non-resident in that state. The dock is physically in a different state, get a non-resident license. The car is registered in a different state, you can't write it into your book unless it is re-registered in your state. If you are not registered in a state as a resident agent or non-resident agent you can't endorse anything, write anything, change anything in that state.

 

[URDRWHO]

On Life, the rules have been lenient and the old adage was to carry some dirt in your pocket so you could write anyone on (home state) soil.
With P&C I don't quite understand your question because you speak of endorsements. Endorsements to what? If the address is in a different state you will need a non-resident in that state. The dock is physically in a different state, get a non-resident license. The car is registered in a different state, you can't write it into your book unless it is re-registered in your state. If you are not registered in a state as a resident agent or non-resident agent you can't endorse anything, write anything, change anything in that state.

I am in Pennsylvania and the homeowners insurance is on Pennsylvania paper. The liability for the dock is in Maryland. The endorsement is for personal liability and it isn't even a dock, it is a slip. The endorsement is on a Pennsylvania form and I want to know where Maryland would get the legal authority to control a Pennsylvania issued policy? The policy forms are filed with the PA Department - not the Maryland department. I have not set foot in Maryland and the rules of Pennsylvania apply to the Pennsylvania insurance contract.

It is totally different from writing a Maryland policy. That policy would be governed by the laws in the State of Maryland.

I can see my clients eyes now. If I were rude I would say, that is a $27 endorsement and I am not licensed in that State, it would cost me more to get licensed, to do pay for continuing ed, etc. So go away. Of course I would never say that but ya get the point. Of course the $50 million a year (I think it is even a lot more than that), 100 employee agency my friend works at would be licensed in every freak'in State.

So is your belief in needing to be licensed the same for Workers Comp 3.C. (other states) coverage. You are endorsing coverage in other listed States. I can hear the call now --- an employee is going through Maryland. Dear Pennsylvania P&C agent, you had a client's employee passing through our State, Maryland is a named State --- are you licensed in MD for temporary coverage?

I'm currently working with the State of PA to try and get support resurrected for H.B. 1887. Finally PA would have a real anti-indemnity statute.

Anyhow since I'm communicating with the DOI --- I may pass this question on to them because I find adding an endorsement to a policy that is in your State of domicile, your are licensed in that State and just because the property is in another State to be a total BS waste of time bureaucracy. But then I'm close to full retirement so I could almost not care.

Personally I have long considered State run insurance rules, regulations and licensing to be antiquated and inefficient.

 

[fed up]

Maryland is probably one of, if not the worst, states to deal with on insurance issues. Are you looking for liability for the boat written on a Pennsylvania policy, or personal liability extended from your homeowners policy? If the slip is rented in Md and you are concerned about a liability issue concerning the dock you would need to get some kind of Maryland policy, probably through the marina. If your boat causes damage in a different state you would be covered. If you personally cause an injury you would be covered by your homeowners. If you left an unsafe condition on the dock and someone was injured I can't see where your homeowners in Pa would cover the liability. It would not be Maryland controlling a Pa policy, it would be a Pa policy denying coverage

 

[fed up]

And I don't see anything in your initial question about WC. Maybe I missed something. Is your employee transporting the boat or auto? Right now I'm lost as to where that part of your reply came from

 

[fed up]

I have worked for captive agents and independents. I was always required to have a license in any state I wrote business in. I personally know of an agent who was hit with an E&O because a producer used the agents dropdown to write or endorse a policy in a state the producer was not licensed in. The state of Maryland did not want to listen to any excuses. the mistake was in interpreting Maryland law and the agent's E&O paid

 

[URDRWHO]

Maryland is probably one of, if not the worst, states to deal with on insurance issues. Are you looking for liability for the boat written on a Pennsylvania policy, or personal liability extended from your homeowners policy? If the slip is rented in Md and you are concerned about a liability issue concerning the dock you would need to get some kind of Maryland policy, probably through the marina. If your boat causes damage in a different state you would be covered. If you personally cause an injury you would be covered by your homeowners. If you left an unsafe condition on the dock and someone was injured I can't see where your homeowners in Pa would cover the liability. It would not be Maryland controlling a Pa policy, it would be a Pa policy denying coverage

Never said this was any boat insurance because that is with Boat USA.

Why can't you see why an endorsed element of liability won't be covered? If Travelers denies liability endorsement on a policy they knowing wrote they have a big legal problem. Liability is liability no matter who, what or where. As long as it went through underwriting, whatever happens the policy will respond accordingly.

From the Encompass policy (address and zip removed) - I think Encompass knows normally knows their legality

Coverage -
PERSONAL LIABILITY $300,000

RESIDENCE LEGAL DATA
SLIP #38 ANNAPOLIS MD

Heck years ago they even had their small boat on Encompass. Their 38 foot one needs Boat USA and all that comes with it.

BOAT PROTECTION (Coverage applies only if a premium or limit is shown)
Boat 1 Boat
Boat Description: 1970 AEROCRAFT
Motor Description: 1976 JOHNSON
Serial Number: Redacted
Trailer Description: 1994 CALKINS


COVERAGES
HULL, MOTOR(S), EQUIPMENT - Limit $2,400
Deductible $500
Trailer Deductible $500
ACTUAL CASH VALUE $Included
COVERAGE Applies
EMERGENCY SERVICE $250 $Included
PROPERTY ON BOARD $5,000 $Included
Your Total Premium For All Boats/Watercrafts $117.00

Now even though the boat was registered in MD that didn't matter. Boats are mobile creatures and can be registered many places in the world. The boat was small enough to be moved by trailer. It was this form G1-71019-A (04-04) BOAT - PENNSYLVANIA.

The boat sat in Annapolis until the end of summer and if anything had happened in Maryland would Encompass say - hey you live in PA, we aren't covering that boat? Hm? Really? It is a boat, it is mobile and can be registered in the Bahama's if they want. Where registered doesn't change the insurance policy.

Ya really think that just because the boat is registered in some far off place that you have to get an agent in that far off place to write a policy on said boat. Maybe but I doubt it.

 

[URDRWHO]

And I don't see anything in your initial question about WC. Maybe I missed something. Is your employee transporting the boat or auto? Right now I'm lost as to where that part of your reply came from

I was using the Other States as an example of how you can add coverage for other States for Temporary coverage as an employee passes through the State. You really think an agent know when or where that employee is but the agent is still covering through the endorsement.

 

[URDRWHO]

I have worked for captive agents and independents. I was always required to have a license in any state I wrote business in. I personally know of an agent who was hit with an E&O because a producer used the agents dropdown to write or endorse a policy in a state the producer was not licensed in. The state of Maryland did not want to listen to any excuses. the mistake was in interpreting Maryland law and the agent's E&O paid

States try all kinds of nonsense and sometimes they win and sometimes they try to extend their States rights outside of the State.
"California Proposes A Wealth Tax Which Taxes You Even After You Leave The State"

Now it would never hit me but good luck trying to collect when someone moves out of State. They are saying it is California's money. I lived in that State and owned real estate, I'll never again live in that insane State.

So what if the insured called the insurance company direct and said --- hey I want to add such and such and endorsement. As long as it is legal insurance, the insurance company could make the endorsement onto the policy. Then what is the agent to do? Run away as though they are on fire?

Again, I am not talking about writing a new policy, on the paper filed in a State for which I am not licensed. You aren't going to see Maryland forms on a PA policy.

 

[URDRWHO]

This died on the vine and I am sure it was because of the State's not wanting to lose their power. But because I am nearing full retirement, because I like beating up the old guard, because I feel that State run insurance is a waste of time and money, I may take on a new jihad.

I have in local Township meetings made the Township attorney sit down on their tail, admitting in front of all that they were wrong, that my wife says one day they'll float me down the river in a 55 gallon drum. I recite the municipal planning code as though it were my own. The big developers that normally get their variances by wink and nod do not like me. Oh well...you'll have this.

So a new job may be to modernize the insurance licensing and regulation business.

Not all agents oppose an optional federal charter